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Thread: 4 xbox's, 2 routers and a problem

  
  1. #1
    imported_irjimbob is offline -Hacks Newbie
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    Hi forum,

    Some background before we start for anyone who doesnt live in the UK. Virgin Media are my ISP, with which I have a 20mbps cable broadband service. They have given me a virgin media hub which is basically a cable modem and router all in one, but its pretty dire.

    I have just moved into a new house as a students and weve just got Virgin Media set up with the "New Amazing Virgin Hub", basically there are 4 of us in the house, each with laptops and xbox's. The problem we have is that we cant connect more than 2 of the xbox's at the same time as they boot each other off. One will always have an open NAT and the other strict, unless we use a laptop to Internet connection share between the xbox and the laptop, where the NAT will change to Moderate. Ive allocated static IP addresses to all xbox's and all laptops, I have tried changing the settings of the hub so that it puts one of the xbox's in the DMZ and then the other 2 will connect but it seems as though the DMZ isnt working as it doesnt matter what IP address I put in there, it doesnt seem to unlock the ports. Ive also changed the port triggering rules to allow the xbox live ports and this makes no difference at all. I have tried setting up port forwarding but this only allows one xbox to have an open NAT. I have tried literally everything I can think of and nothing seems to work. If there is no way that you can do it with the hub then we are just about willing to get a separate router etc but we have a very tight budget as we are all students and would only do this as a last resort as this is getting ridiculous.

    Ive also tried to connect a separate Belkin router to the hub and use that instead by disabling DHCP on thee hub and assigning the 2nd router a static IP that I then put in the Hubs DMZ. This still doesnt fix anything but the 2nd router doesnt have port triggering which from the little info I can find apparently helps, but some confirmation that getting a router with port triggering would be nice so that I dont go out and buy another router only to find it hasnt fizxed anything.

    Thanks for any help,

    Jamie


  2. #2
    Powerslave is offline Gone fishin -Hacks Titan
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    You don't need NAT, don't need DMZ unless you are hosting something on that address, you only need ONE router.

    Go to XBOX LIVE site and look at all the connection options.

    You said you have a virgin HUB, that is NOT a router, it is a HUB. If that is the case, THEY assign two units an IP address, and that may be what they are limiting it to. You need to plug the one virgin HUB port, into the WAN port of the router, then your devices into the ROUTER. You have to configure the router for the correct protocols, and It must be setup as DHCP, so the router assigns addresses to the units. Your router would get assigned the ONE IP address from the HUB.

    If you have to LOG IN to your service, the router needs configured for that, which is like PPPoE. You get a space in the router for username and password.

    If it is an ALWAYS ON connection, then you don't need to do that.

    I can't find any info on the HUB, as you didn't specify any model number, and so on.

    If you are using TWO routers, their BASE (Gateway) IP addresses must be changed. Like, one is 192.168.1.1, and the other would have to be 198.162.2.1 - you have to log in to them, and configure them independently; they both CANNOT have the same IP address, which is the gateway address.. Also, devices on the ONE router will not see the devices on the other one, so that means no LOCAL LAN play.

  3. #3
    imported_irjimbob is offline -Hacks Newbie
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    Thanks for the swift reply,

    http://shop.virginmedia.com/broadban...s-routers.html

    According to the bottom of the router, its a Netgear VMDG280

    The one thats at the top of the page is the one that I have, its a Netgear router/modem with Virgin branded firmware on. I am pretty sure that its a modem and router rolled into one. It has no problem assigning addresses to each xbox but even when DHCP is activated and all devices are set to automatic they cant all connect to xbox live together. I cant set my Belkin router that I had before virgin, as this is a router and not a modem, so I cant connect that to the wall as the I only have coax cable from the wall and the router only has an ethernet port to connect to a modem, which is why I set the Netgear virgin hub as the modem and put the router in the DMZ. I hope this makes sense, lol.

    The belkin router is a Belkin F5D7230-4 which currently connects all the xbox's to the modem through the DMZ of the Virgin router. I have assigned each router a separate IP and the laptops have no problem connecting through ethernet or wireless to the Belkin router.

  4. #4
    Powerslave is offline Gone fishin -Hacks Titan
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    I have four Xboxs on my LAN, they all connect fine, so it's a configuration issue.

    You don't put the router in the DMZ, that's not what it's (DMZ) for. The DMZ is for routing EXTERNAL requests to that specific IP, why are you using that in this configuration? You set a connected PC as the DMZ, like if you are running a web host program, you would NEED to do that, so that ONLY THAT PC gets sends and receives data to the external IP requests. You don't set a routers IP as a DMZ, that won't work. So, when someone types the IP address of your modem in their web browser, it sends it to the IP specified in the DMZ. Why you did it the way you are doing it, is just not required.

    You simply connect one port of the MODEM/ROUTER, to the ROUTER, then devices to the router. You must then RESET the MODEM while the router is ON.

    I am using the SAME ROUTER as you, and I have eight devices connected at any given time, and sometimes all THREE XBOX 360s! YOU are causing the problem.

  5. #5
    imported_irjimbob is offline -Hacks Newbie
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    the reason i put the router in the DMZ was because I was reading another forum about connecting a router to the Virgin Hub and they were stating that it wouldnt work unless the router was in the Hubs DMZ because otherwise there would be a "double NAT" which would cause problems. How true that was idk. Ive now removed the router from the DMZ, it is now connected to the Hub with an ethernet cable. All 4 xbox's are now connected to the router with ethernet cables and Ive still got the same problem, where it will only allow 2 xbox's maximum onto live.
    Ive also tried disconnecting the 2nd router and re-enabling the routing functionality on the virgin hub, I have enabled UPNP, disabled DMZ, port forwarding, port triggering and the firewall, only to still have exactly the same problem :/

  6. #6
    Powerslave is offline Gone fishin -Hacks Titan
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    So, you can have, say 1 or 2 PCs on, while the 2 Xboxs on right? It is ONLY when you want to use more than 2 Xbox 360s? It's not the total number of devices, only TWO Xbox360s or two of anything? Beats me, I got four in my home, but only three are on at any ONE time, and they all work fine. YOu may want to ask your ISP if they are limiting your connections to the live servers.

    You have checked and have verified that all the 360s get separate IP addresses?

    All four have separate profiles?

    DHCP is enabled in the router you are using?

    If you are getting IP adresses from the ISP, they limit the number of connections you can have. Your addresses, for all the connected devices should have 192.168.1.xxx - that format. Mine are 192.168.2.xxx, and I always have four live connections - Cable box, Media Server, WiFi Access Point, and Media Dock, oh, and a range extender, so that's FIVE, one wireless, the extender.

  7. #7
    imported_irjimbob is offline -Hacks Newbie
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    Yeah, DHCP is definitely giving individual addresses, Ive also tried assigning separate ones.
    Its only the xbox's that get kicked off, I can have all four laptops a desktop PC, 3 smartphones and 2 xbox's. If i add another xbox it just kicks one of the xbox's off, not affecting any other device just the xbox.
    Its really weird I cant figure out any reason why is not allowing them. I know its something to do with the ports not being forwarded to the correct ip addresses, which is why I though port triggering would help my situation but it seems to do very little as far as this particular router is concerned.
    Is there any software that you can get for your pc or something that would take the data coming from the xbox to the laptop through ICS and change the ports when forwarding to the router and then change them back when it gets a reply? Something like that would be great as that would mean I could get a setup with no conflicting ports allowing them all to theoretically have open NAT types. The only problem then would be the lag that would come from that kind of setup. Which could be another problem.

    Thanks for all your help so far, its certainly made it easier for me to tick off things that arent causing the problem.

    Jamie

  8. #8
    Powerslave is offline Gone fishin -Hacks Titan
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    IF two XB360s work, FOUR should also work. Ports and forwarding are FINE if others are working. I don't use port forwarding, and all three XB360s get on line just fine. Maybe something's changed, I should test it. Maybe the Live servers are not allowing more than two connections from your IP address. Maybe your ISP is doing it. When you have TWO on, then go for the 3rd, one Xbox just pops up that it was disconnected from Live? If so, your ISP or M$ is doing that.

  9. #9
    imported_irjimbob is offline -Hacks Newbie
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    I thought I should give you all an update just in case anyone else is having a similar problem. It turns out that the Virgin Media hub, although it is has the option, doesnt allow multiple devices to use the same ports. I have now bought a new Belkin cable router and now everything works perfectly. All the xbox's can go online at the same time and even play against each other. The new Belkin router is now plugged into the virgin hub as before with all the same settings and now it works. Not quite sure what the problem was with the original Belkin router but it all works now, so I am happy.

  10. #10
    Adders is offline -Hacks Smarty
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    I've had no end of problems with the routers that virgin supply, particularly with my Blackberry. They use their own custom firmware in them, whichever brand they supply you with and you can't change said firmware. If you are a Virgin customer, buy your own router from the start, you will in the long run anyway.
    When the need arises, anything and everything becomes a hammer!

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